tankme

I would think that the majority of the investment was already spent by the time Tamiya announced theirs and deals to produce already cut. I guess it which one I would buy remains to be seen as I do want one, but neither is going to be my next tank as my next one is Russian... No surprise there though.

RichJohnson

Well competition is good for the consumer. But for cost comparison, spares, and quality, the Tamiya is going to win. Haya doesnt even have the adjustable idler last I heard. If they do, good for them for adding a required part. I still knock Taigen for not having adjustable idlers for the Shermans and other tanks.

afv aficionado

Is this the same Tamiya who've stopped spare parts for Sherman & Pershing kits?

Andrew (Haya) has posted on RC Tank Warfare -
--- this 3D printed is only for the purpose to see details . The final products will be moulds injected ABS plastic , like chieftain. Rubber tyres not same as the 3D printed sample , just painted by hand. The final tyres are properly down scaled from the real ones in the tank museum.

Mal

tankme

I was just going to post that Mal...you beat me to it...lol

afv aficionado

Great minds?

Mal

pitstain

Chuck Norris builds Tamiya tanks,

Chuck Norris doesn't worry about spare parts.

Chuck Norris buys spare tanks as parts donors.

But yeah Tamiya can be difficult these days for spare parts for those of us who are not Chuck Norris.

afv aficionado

Is that just a really complicated way to say everyone?

Mal

RichJohnson

As if a 22 year run for the Sherman was not long enough before it’s discontinued. While I lament its loss, I have most of the spares AAF had in stock as I have many Sherman’s, and really, the only things that wear are the gears and tires and track. All but the tires can be sourced elsewhere. Heck Tamiya supported their product longer than GM makes spares for their cars..
then there is the after market cabal of suppliers who will pick up the slack.
however I suspect that most of the tanks Tamiya discontinued was a result of COVID as I was told they discontinued some rc cars and semis as well. We may see some of that return in the next few years. We can hope.

So far we know Haya is a bit better than Hooben, but with the deficiencies we saw in the cheifton they produced, I don’t see them even meeting the standard of henglong unless they step up their game.
we will see.
so like i said, competition is good, go for it and make the product but I hope it’s market priced for what you get.

afv aficionado

"So far we know Haya is a bit better than Hooben, but with the deficiencies we saw in the cheifton they produced, I don’t see them even meeting the standard of henglong unless they step up their game."

A bit better than Hooben? A hell of a lot better going by your reports on both the Sherman & Merkava.
Chieftain deficiencies - You do realise that is their 1st model? An actual model, not Hooben vapor ware (Hooben E100 for example). You might also recall that HL wasn't very good when they started, in fact for quite a long time after they started.
It's not perfect by any means, but you can get spares for it & Haya listen to the their public, unlike what you've reported with Hooben.
As for upping their game, they produced the metal tension idler, rubber padded tracks for Chieftain, 3D printed upgrade set, fabric gun covers, decent crew figures (also a crew set for Centurion, already), they're in process of making rubber tyres for Centurion which may be backward compatible with Chieftain - as they used the same roadwheels.
I think I can safely say they are upping their game & much more swiftly than either HL or Hooben.have.
Price is an issue true, it reflects a smaller production run & not having a globally recognised brand.

Sorry for the rant

Mal

Crius

Rich, that's not really saying much. Just about everybody is better than hooben.

RichJohnson

My main reference was the plastic wheels on plastic control arm axles on his chieftain. HL has well proven that design eats its self destroying both the wheel hole and the axle.
While not talking up the Hooben Merk, it has bearings in the wheels and idler and has an adjustable idler albeit complicated to deal with, it’s there. Had the merk been in the plastic they used for the fury it would have been pretty close to a slam dunk. The fury is plastic on plastic and in the time Fsttanks and I tested it out it was eating itself. Just as the original design HL Shermans do.

i just could not believe that at the time Haya designed their cheifton, with the knowledge available, they passed on wheel bushings and an idler. Putting an idler kit out later (I was not aware of) as a fix is admirable and shows adaptation with the manufacturer, but my point was, as is, I call it an epic fail, the time to accept bad HL 2005 quality is long past. I guess you just don’t buy the first product a company puts out till they learn what they are doing, but imho they should have known before their first model.

I fully expected the Merkava to be an injection molded body on a metal frame as they advertised but clearly they had a different production plan than it appeared. I will make it work with my skills but many can’t do that and it just isn’t right.

hopefully haya makes a good tank model out of the box this time.
if he were intuitive, he would make sure his Centurian sprockets match Tamiya so they can share the same track. Open up another market for him.

afv aficionado

In an ideal world, yes, 1st entry would be perfect. Sadly, or luckily, we're not there yet. That would be a very high bar to entry.
As it is, most models I've seen have had incremental improvement over time. Seems to be that is the path most taken.

Re the Chieftain idler, the pre production version was plastic, but on release the metal version was on the tank.

One of the really good things about HAYA is that they have been willing to listen & adapt, and tell us what they're planning (with in reason). Can you say similar with Hooben or Tamiya? Just on that, I'd cut them some slack, because it's such a novel approach.

Forgot - intuitive designers are fairly sparse on the ground, & it may be too late to change the design to match Tamiya's surprise by now.
Mal

cleong

The RC tank market is so sparse that I honestly feel we can afford to be more generous in our assessment of each company's product (excepting outright scams).

Can't we just buy what we want without talking down the alternatives that we dismissed?

Every product price and quality level will have garner some customers.

Some are willing to pay more to take a chance that they'd get a decent and unique tank.

Some will not pay fair dollar even if the tank is of reasonable quality because they're demanding and out for a deal (not pointing fingers, this is just hypothetical)

As I said before somewhere else, a market dominated by one company or another leaves much of the hobbyists with limited choices and that can not be a good thing.