Welcome to Club SAITO !
04-05-2020, 07:17 AM
Yep, you can't defy physics. In this case the Bernoulli effect.
Design for cylinder charging and expelling effeciencies is so complicated that computer programs are used to design today's engines. The smallest change to one of the dozens of variables can have a dramatic effect on desired performance. Won't keep me from trying though.
Even though the Saito engineers have developed a line a very strong engines they had to make some compromises to keep costs down. Namely the machining, or lack thereof, in the inlet and outlet ports. I believe that with a little careful smoothing of the short turn radii significant effeciency gains can be realized. My fa82 pig is a good candidate for such an endeaver.
For all you naysayers out there, yes I could simply move up to the next size engine but where's the fun in that? It's obvious to me at least that the fa82 has issues, it's just a matter of finding and solving them. The higher flow exhaust helped, the compression increase helped too. The larger carb didn't help and therefore I doubt seriously that a larger intake tube would either. All things point to flow effeciency problems. Dremel time!
Design for cylinder charging and expelling effeciencies is so complicated that computer programs are used to design today's engines. The smallest change to one of the dozens of variables can have a dramatic effect on desired performance. Won't keep me from trying though.
Even though the Saito engineers have developed a line a very strong engines they had to make some compromises to keep costs down. Namely the machining, or lack thereof, in the inlet and outlet ports. I believe that with a little careful smoothing of the short turn radii significant effeciency gains can be realized. My fa82 pig is a good candidate for such an endeaver.
For all you naysayers out there, yes I could simply move up to the next size engine but where's the fun in that? It's obvious to me at least that the fa82 has issues, it's just a matter of finding and solving them. The higher flow exhaust helped, the compression increase helped too. The larger carb didn't help and therefore I doubt seriously that a larger intake tube would either. All things point to flow effeciency problems. Dremel time!
Well
04-05-2020, 07:38 AM
Don't know if it is the same one, but I do know from looking at the 2.7 when I bought my truck, that the drivers side has one port in the back of the head, so my guess is that is the passenger side head for the 2.7. I remember reading somewhere about all the engineering that went into the 2.7 as it was designed from the ground up to be turbocharged, where the 3.5 is based on an existing 3.5 NA engine design, but the block was modified for the turbo cooling and oiling. The 3.5 uses a compact manifold design, but the heads are still standard one port per cylinder. From what owners of the 2.7 say it is one powerful fast little engine, and well suited for the F150.
04-05-2020, 12:39 PM
My Feedback: (1)
Don't know if it is the same one, but I do know from looking at the 2.7 when I bought my truck, that the drivers side has one port in the back of the head, so my guess is that is the passenger side head for the 2.7. I remember reading somewhere about all the engineering that went into the 2.7 as it was designed from the ground up to be turbocharged, where the 3.5 is based on an existing 3.5 NA engine design, but the block was modified for the turbo cooling and oiling. The 3.5 uses a compact manifold design, but the heads are still standard one port per cylinder. From what owners of the 2.7 say it is one powerful fast little engine, and well suited for the F150.
the head in the photo above is for the Camaro SS V6,, here is another photo below, of the V8, I find it very surprising Chevy is producing a V6 with 4 over head cams. did Ferrari buy GM LOL
looks like there's room to open-up the exhaust port
Jim
Last edited by the Wasp; 04-05-2020 at 01:05 PM.
04-05-2020, 01:04 PM
My Feedback: (1)
Yep, you can't defy physics. In this case the Bernoulli effect.
Design for cylinder charging and expelling effeciencies is so complicated that computer programs are used to design today's engines. The smallest change to one of the dozens of variables can have a dramatic effect on desired performance. Won't keep me from trying though.
Even though the Saito engineers have developed a line a very strong engines they had to make some compromises to keep costs down. Namely the machining, or lack thereof, in the inlet and outlet ports. I believe that with a little careful smoothing of the short turn radii significant effeciency gains can be realized. My fa82 pig is a good candidate for such an endeaver.
For all you naysayers out there, yes I could simply move up to the next size engine but where's the fun in that? It's obvious to me at least that the fa82 has issues, it's just a matter of finding and solving them. The higher flow exhaust helped, the compression increase helped too. The larger carb didn't help and therefore I doubt seriously that a larger intake tube would either. All things point to flow effeciency problems. Dremel time!
Design for cylinder charging and expelling effeciencies is so complicated that computer programs are used to design today's engines. The smallest change to one of the dozens of variables can have a dramatic effect on desired performance. Won't keep me from trying though.
Even though the Saito engineers have developed a line a very strong engines they had to make some compromises to keep costs down. Namely the machining, or lack thereof, in the inlet and outlet ports. I believe that with a little careful smoothing of the short turn radii significant effeciency gains can be realized. My fa82 pig is a good candidate for such an endeaver.
For all you naysayers out there, yes I could simply move up to the next size engine but where's the fun in that? It's obvious to me at least that the fa82 has issues, it's just a matter of finding and solving them. The higher flow exhaust helped, the compression increase helped too. The larger carb didn't help and therefore I doubt seriously that a larger intake tube would either. All things point to flow effeciency problems. Dremel time!
you have to be careful of when measuring the Saitos intake manifold's OD, because the 4 I have measured were not perfectly round, because of the bend that was put in them
Jim
Last edited by the Wasp; 04-05-2020 at 01:07 PM.
04-05-2020, 02:05 PM
How could you for get the infamous Quad 4 engines it rates right up there with the unforgettable Cadillac V8-6-4?
04-05-2020, 02:29 PM
Hmm GM is finally coming into the 21st century with a DOHC V engine, majority of their engines are all pushrods, and you can't do 4 valves per cylinder with pushrods. GM needs to step up their engines, because aside from the Ram Cummins, no other manufacturer can compete with the Ford powerplants. When Ram touted 1000 TQ, Ford engineers said, hold my beer. 1050TQ. I watched some dyno runs, that new powerstroke is one powerful Diesel. They were pulling near 1000 TQ on a stock engine, at the wheels.
So is GM going to turbocharge that V6? Would make sense to make a cast in manifold if they are, if not, pretty much locks the engine in for mods and power increases.
04-05-2020, 03:42 PM
Lonnie, the FA 115 has the same size Header tube threads as the 91, that poor 115, but that 115 is one engine I wont mess with.
you have to be careful of when measuring the Saitos intake manifold's OD, because the 4 I have measured were not perfectly round, because of the bend that was put in them
Jim
you have to be careful of when measuring the Saitos intake manifold's OD, because the 4 I have measured were not perfectly round, because of the bend that was put in them
Jim
I PM'd you about the 100 carb.
PM'd you too Gary.
04-05-2020, 05:56 PM
My Feedback: (1)
Hmm GM is finally coming into the 21st century with a DOHC V engine, majority of their engines are all pushrods, and you can't do 4 valves per cylinder with pushrods. GM needs to step up their engines, because aside from the Ram Cummins, no other manufacturer can compete with the Ford powerplants. When Ram touted 1000 TQ, Ford engineers said, hold my beer. 1050TQ. I watched some dyno runs, that new powerstroke is one powerful Diesel. They were pulling near 1000 TQ on a stock engine, at the wheels.
So is GM going to turbocharge that V6? Would make sense to make a cast in manifold if they are, if not, pretty much locks the engine in for mods and power increases.
So is GM going to turbocharge that V6? Would make sense to make a cast in manifold if they are, if not, pretty much locks the engine in for mods and power increases.
I'm betting Chevy will put one of those small blowers on the V6 like the ones on the 427 Vet/Camaro, those small blowers putout almost as much air as a 6-71.
Jim
04-06-2020, 03:40 AM
My Feedback: (102)
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Colonial Beach, VA
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Keeping the exhaust as hot as is possible for Turbo Charging is a great benefit, bolting the Turbo directly to the head makes perfect sense.
Last edited by Hobbsy; 04-06-2020 at 03:49 AM. Reason: Alter content to make more sense.
04-06-2020, 05:02 AM
Hey Gary Pete says to pass this along:
i like gary's choice of a brough superior ss 100 like t e lawrence/lawrence of arabia rode, that guy had huge balls. During ww2 he'd ride long distances at the weekend on very average roads while averaging 80mph or more which was eventually his undoing. He was riding down a narrow english country lane bordered by thick hedges when a young boy on a bicycle came out of a gap in the hedge. He swerved to miss him and was killed instantly.
I don't remember if I mentioned it my youngest son the Paramedic came down sick last week and his partner on the ambulance was hosipitalized both are suspected to have the COVID-19. Test are so far backed up they he won't get the test results until late this week. He is recovering nicely and hios partner was release yesterday and is recovering it at home. Alast there was one small casualty that has really pissed him off!
Before
After
The reason
i like gary's choice of a brough superior ss 100 like t e lawrence/lawrence of arabia rode, that guy had huge balls. During ww2 he'd ride long distances at the weekend on very average roads while averaging 80mph or more which was eventually his undoing. He was riding down a narrow english country lane bordered by thick hedges when a young boy on a bicycle came out of a gap in the hedge. He swerved to miss him and was killed instantly.
I don't remember if I mentioned it my youngest son the Paramedic came down sick last week and his partner on the ambulance was hosipitalized both are suspected to have the COVID-19. Test are so far backed up they he won't get the test results until late this week. He is recovering nicely and hios partner was release yesterday and is recovering it at home. Alast there was one small casualty that has really pissed him off!
Before
After
The reason
04-07-2020, 05:07 AM
I'm surprise no one commented on the "Osiyo" on my son Scott's shirt? No word on his COVID-19 test results yet. My lung problems are kicking up to the point I need to call the doctor today. I'm a little scared about going in to the office, Not because I think I might the virus (it feels like the usual lung iritation in the upper lobes) but I might get exposed going to the clinic.
Pete tells me since they started having senior citizen shopping hours at the local stores it has solved his beer problem. He said: "Yes although i have a 2011 hyundai iload van and they usually use the forklift to load the pallet in the back." I'm not sure if he is kidding, knowing Pete I think he isn't! :0 Pete's daughter is a nurse who is like 8 months pregnant he is worried about here and the baby with the virus running around. She has started her maternity leave to go into quarantine.
Pete tells me since they started having senior citizen shopping hours at the local stores it has solved his beer problem. He said: "Yes
although i have a 2011 hyundai iload van and they usually use the forklift to load the pallet in the back." I'm not sure if he is kidding, knowing Pete I think he isn't! :0 Pete's daughter is a nurse who is like 8 months pregnant he is worried about here and the baby with the virus running around. She has started her maternity leave to go into quarantine.
04-07-2020, 12:14 PM
My Feedback: (1)
Pete, I believe all things in the universe are connected. that comes from the Native American in me. about 1/3 percent. something tells me you are going to have a new grandson. when he get's old enough he will be picking on you, yes he will be just like you
I saw that "Osiyo" thing, but I knew nothing about it.
Jim
I saw that "Osiyo" thing, but I knew nothing about it.
Jim
04-07-2020, 12:25 PM
Pete, I believe all things in the universe are connected. that comes from the Native American in me. about 1/3 percent. something tells me you are going to have a new grandson. when he get's old enough he will be picking on you, yes he will be just like you
I saw that "Osiyo" thing, but I knew nothing about it.
Jim
I saw that "Osiyo" thing, but I knew nothing about it.
Jim
04-07-2020, 12:33 PM
My Feedback: (1)
04-08-2020, 07:41 AM
I thought it meant " new mutton chops".
Couple maidens to get a laugh out of at our field recently.
Socially distant of course.
Enjoy a dirversion from the difficulty of the times.
Remember all in prayer.
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